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	<title>The Widmann Blog &#187; linguistics</title>
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	<link>http://blog.widmann.org.uk</link>
	<description>Thomas Widmann&#039;s blog about politics, linguistics, programming, food, kids and life in general</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 18 May 2012 22:02:59 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>Multilingual Wordfeud</title>
		<link>http://blog.widmann.org.uk/2012/05/03/5428/</link>
		<comments>http://blog.widmann.org.uk/2012/05/03/5428/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 May 2012 21:28:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>thomas</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[en]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[games]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[linguistics]]></category>

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		<description><![CDATA[I&#8217;ve always enjoyed a game of Scrabble every now and then, but I must say it&#8217;s much more enjoyable on a smartphone than in real life. To be honest, it&#8217;s not official Scrabble that I&#8217;m playing, but Wordfeud; however, for all practical purposes it&#8217;s the same. In particular I like to play simultaneously in several [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://blog.widmann.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/6988992798_31fac6916f_o.jpg"><img src="http://blog.widmann.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/6988992798_31fac6916f_o.jpg" alt="" title="Wordfeud screendump" width="40%" class="alignright size-full wp-image-5429" /></a>I&#8217;ve always enjoyed a game of Scrabble every now and then, but I must say it&#8217;s much more enjoyable on a smartphone than in real life. <img src='http://blog.widmann.org.uk/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' />
<p>To be honest, it&#8217;s not official Scrabble that I&#8217;m playing, but <a href="http://wordfeud.com/">Wordfeud</a>; however, for all practical purposes it&#8217;s the same.
<p>In particular I like to play simultaneously in several languages.  I&#8217;m struggling a bit with Norwegian (because it doesn&#8217;t do Nynorsk, which is the variety I know), but I&#8217;ve played very enjoyable games in Swedish, Dutch and Spanish, apart from the obvious Danish and English.
<p>PS: If you&#8217;ve got an HTC ChaCha, too, did you realise you can take a screenshot by holding down the red button and pressing Home?</p>
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		<title>Underliggende geminerede konsonanter på dansk</title>
		<link>http://blog.widmann.org.uk/2012/04/17/5366/</link>
		<comments>http://blog.widmann.org.uk/2012/04/17/5366/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Apr 2012 22:01:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>thomas</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[da]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[linguistics]]></category>

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		<description><![CDATA[1974 Three Little Soldiers Originally uploaded by JD Hancock Jeg erindrer ikke nogensinde at have set emnet nævnt i fonetikbøgerne på lingvistikstudiet i Århus i 1990erne, men jeg er begyndt at blive bevidst om, at jeg rutinemæssigt producerer geminerede konsonanter, når jeg synger på dansk. Hvis jeg fx synger Tre små soldater, synger jeg linien [...]]]></description>
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<span style="font-size: 0.9em; margin-top: 0px;"><br />
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/jdhancock/3728846816/">1974 Three Little Soldiers</a><br />
Originally uploaded by <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/jdhancock/">JD Hancock</a><br />
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<p>Jeg erindrer ikke nogensinde at have set emnet nævnt i fonetikbøgerne på lingvistikstudiet i Århus i 1990erne, men jeg er begyndt at blive bevidst om, at jeg rutinemæssigt producerer geminerede konsonanter, når jeg synger på dansk.
<p>Hvis jeg fx synger <i>Tre små soldater</i>, synger jeg linien <i>Lille soldat</i> som [lilːə sold̥æːd̥], ikke som [liːlə sold̥æːd̥].  Jeg vil dog ikke mene, sidstnævnte udtale er umulig, blot at den forekommer mig mindre naturlig.
<p>Derudover har jeg bemærket, at jeg også producerer geminerede konsonanter i bestemte andre sammenhænge.  For eksempel udtaler jeg normalt <i>Lille Anna</i> som [ˈlilə ˈænæ], men hvis hun har slået sig, og jeg skal trøste hende, virker det mere naturligt at sige [ˈlilːə ˈænːæ].
<p>Kan evt. dansksprogede, der læser dette, bekræfte, at I også geminerer konsonanter under visse forudsætninger?  Og har I set det beskrevet nogetsteds?
<p>Hvis vi antager, at disse geminerede konsonanter er en del af dansk udtale, leder det naturligt til spørgsmålet, om et ord som <i>lille</i> underliggende er [ˈlilə] (hvilket betyder, at konsonanter nogle gange forlænges fonetisk efter kort trykstærk vokal) eller [ˈlilːə] (hvilket betyder, at geminerede konsonanter reduceres i de fleste sammenhænge).
<p>Jeg véd ikke, hvad svaret er, men hvis man vælger sidstnævnte analyse, får det dansk til underliggende at ligne norsk og svensk mere, end man umiddelbart skulle tro.</p>
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		<title>Fællesdansk</title>
		<link>http://blog.widmann.org.uk/2012/04/05/5346/</link>
		<comments>http://blog.widmann.org.uk/2012/04/05/5346/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Apr 2012 23:52:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>thomas</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[da]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[linguistics]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[nb]]></category>

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		<description><![CDATA[Takket være the WayBackMachine er her et forslag, jeg udarbeidede for en del år siden, om at gjenskabe et fælles skriftsprog for norsk og dansk. Indledning Dansk og norsk skriftsprog har nu været adskilte i over hundrede år. Mange er af den formening at det kun er norsk som har ændret sig i den forgangne [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Takket være <a href="http://web.archive.org/web/20060521144931/http://www.twid.bibulus.org/faellesdansk.html">the WayBackMachine</a> er her et forslag, jeg udarbeidede for en del år siden, om at gjenskabe et fælles skriftsprog for norsk og dansk.</p>
<h3>Indledning</h3>
<p>Dansk og norsk skriftsprog har nu været adskilte i over hundrede år.
<p>Mange er af den formening at det kun er norsk som har ændret sig i den forgangne tid og at dansk har stået stille.
<p>Men det er ikke tilfældet! På moderne dansk skrives til eksempel <b>øj</b> for ældre <b>øi</b>, og <b>ej</b> for ældre <b>ei</b>, og <b>j</b> i <b>gj/kj</b> er slettet.  Mange ord og bøininger har også ændret sig, til eksempel <b>lille</b> for ældre <b>liden</b>.
<p>Mange af de ændringer som er sket, har dog paralleller på norsk, til eksempel indførelsen af tegnet <b>å</b>.
<p>Formålet med fællesdansk er at føre de to skriftsprog sammen igjen. Som udgangspunkt bruges sidste fælles skriftsprog (omkring 1870 &#8211; desværre publiceredes der mig bekjendt ingen fælles retskrivningsordliste der kan bruges som basis), og ændringer som er sket på begge sprog, accepteres.
<p>Til eksempel skriver vi ikke *&#8221;Der bor en liden Pige med deilige Øine i det blaa Huus&#8221;, men &#8220;Der bor en liden pige med deilige øine i det blå hus&#8221;.  Bemærk forskjellene til særdansk &#8220;Der bor en lille pige med dejlige øjne i det blå hus&#8221; og særnorsk (konservativt bokmål) &#8220;Det bor en liten pike med deilige øyne i det blå hus&#8221; (for slet ikke at tale om nynorsk &#8220;Det bur ei lita jente med deilige augo i det blå huset&#8221;).</p>
<h2>Betydninger</h2>
<p>De samme principper gjør sig gjældende for betydningen.  Dersom et ord ikke betyder det samme i dag på både norsk og dansk, er betydningen på fællesdansk som udgangspunkt den samme som omkring 1870.
<p>Til eksempel&#8230;<br />
<h3>Ordliste</h3>
<p>deilig, -t, -e.
<p>dere <em>pron.</em>, <em>norsk</em> -> I.
<p>du, dig, <em>jfv.</em> din.
<p>flink, -t, -e. (1) &#8220;dygtig&#8221;. (2) <em>dansk</em> -> venlig.
<p>fåfængt, -, -e (&#8220;unyttig, resultatløs, bortkastet&#8221;); <em>særlig   norsk</em>.
<p>får, -et, -.
<p>gjed, -en, -er.
<p>grave, grov <em>eller</em> gravede, gravet.
<p>gut, -ten, -ter; <em>særlig norsk</em> -> dreng.
<p>hus, -et, -e.
<p>hvornår, <em>adv</em>;<em>dansk</em> -> når.
<p>I <em>pron.</em>, eder, eders.
<p>i dag.
<p>jeg, mig, <em>jfv.</em> min.
<p>jente, -n, -r; <em>særlig norsk</em> -> pige.
<p>jer <em>pron.</em>, <em>dansk</em> -> eder <em>opslag under</em> I.
<p>kjende, -te.
<p>kjød, -et.
<p>ko, -en, kjør (???).
<p>koselig, -t, -e; <em>norsk</em> -> hyggelig.
<p>kunne, kan, kunne, kunnet.
<p>liden, lidet, små, <em>bestemt form</em> lille.
<p>måtte, må, måtte, måttet.
<p>når, <em>adv og konj</em>.  &#8220;Når kommer I?&#8221;
<p>rar, -t, -e. (1)<em>norsk</em> -> mærkelig. (2) <em>dansk</em> ->   venlig.
<p>pige, -n, -r; <em>norsk også</em> jente.
<p>sau, -en, -er; <em>norsk</em> -> får.
<p>skulle, skal, skulle, skullet.
<p>smuk, -t, -ke; <em>særlig dansk</em> -> vakker.
<p>istedenfor <em>adv.</em> <em>eller</em> i stedet for.
<p>vakker, -t, vakre.
<p>ville, vil, ville, villet.
<p>vor, -t, -e.
<p>vågen, -t, -ne.
<p>øie -t, øine.<br />
<h3>Eksempler</h3>
<p>Nøddebo Præstegaard, p. 193, oprindelig udgave:
<p>&#8220;Ja, hvad er det?&#8221; udbrød hun, &#8220;vi er jo aldeles paa feil Vei; de to Bøgetræer der kjender jeg ikke.  Men bi nu lidt&#8221;, vedblev hun og saae op mod Himlen.  &#8220;Hvor er Solen nu henne &#8211; den er ganske dækket af Skyer &#8211; jo der er der lidt klart, der maa den være: men saa kjøre vi jo mod Øst, istedenfor at vi skulde kjøre mod Nord.&#8221;
<p>&#8220;Ja, hvad er det?&#8221; udbrød hun, &#8220;vi er jo aldeles paa feil vei; de to bøgetræer der kjender jeg ikke.  Men vent nu lidt&#8221;, vedblev hun og så op mod himlen.  &#8220;Hvor er solen nu henne &#8211; den er ganske dækket af skyer &#8211; jo der er der lidt klart, der må den være: men så kjører vi jo mod øst, istedenfor at vi skulle kjøre mod nord.&#8221;
<p>Syndere i sommersol, p.34:
<p>Pludselig sov jeg ikke længere. Jeg var halvvågen og følte at jeg ikke var alene. Nogen havde gået i en dør, et vinddrag havde pustet henover mit ansigt &#8211; eller kanskje var det bare en drøm.
<p>Jeg åbnede øinene med møie. På øielokkerne (øielågene?) kunne jeg mærke at det endnu var ganske tidligt på morgenen.
<p>En skygge stod borte ved døren.
<p>En ung pige. Hun stod stille og så på mig. Jeg kjendte hende ikke.
<p>Jeg var for søvnig til at være nysgjerrig. Jeg sagde til mig selv atdette sikkert var en drøm, altså kunne jeg roligt vende ryggen til ogsove videre. Men denne tanke udfordrede min kritik og vækkede mig. Nårman siger til sig selv at man drømmer, da er man vågen, og det ved man selv. Når man virkelig drømmer, tror man aldrig at man drømmer. Heller ikke når man er vågen. Man tror overhovedet aldrig at man drømmer, undtagen i det ene lynsnare øieblik da man vågner op af en drøm, altså i det øieblik da man holder op med at drømme –</p>
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		<title>Svenska är ett lätt främmande språk för danskar</title>
		<link>http://blog.widmann.org.uk/2012/03/08/4594/</link>
		<comments>http://blog.widmann.org.uk/2012/03/08/4594/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Mar 2012 23:21:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>thomas</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[education]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[linguistics]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[sv]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.widmann.org.uk/?p=4594</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[lära svenska Originally uploaded by loopkid Jag tog del i en språkkonferens i Köpenhamn i oktober, och dess slogan var: &#8220;Du förstår mer än du tror &#8211; om du törs&#8221;. Jag är oenig. Danskar förstår inte svenska om de aldrig varit i Sverige, aldrig sett svenska TV och aldrig haft svenska vänner, om de så [...]]]></description>
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<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/loopkid/2319237380/">lära svenska</a><br />
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<p>Jag tog del i en språkkonferens i Köpenhamn i oktober, och dess slogan var: &#8220;Du förstår mer än du tror &ndash; om du törs&#8221;.
<p>Jag är oenig.  Danskar förstår inte svenska om de aldrig varit i Sverige, aldrig sett svenska TV och aldrig haft svenska vänner, om de så törs eller inte.
<p>Jag förstår svenska därför att en svensk flicka på mitt baskiskkurs i Donostia pratade svenska med mig i pauserna. Jag förstod inte ett ord av talad svenska före kursen.
<p>Det vore mycket bättre att undervisa svenska som främmande språk i danska skolor, om än ett mycket lätt främmande språk som eleverna snabbt kan lära.  Målet skulle inte vara att prata 100% korrekt svenska, utan att förstå svensk som en infött och att kunna kommunicera med svensktalande utan kunskap i danska språket.
<p>Om svenskar och norrmän gjorde detsamma, skulle den nordiska språkgemenskapen återigen väckas till liv.</p>
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		<title>The new meaning of the word ‘Unionist’</title>
		<link>http://blog.widmann.org.uk/2012/03/05/5080/</link>
		<comments>http://blog.widmann.org.uk/2012/03/05/5080/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Mar 2012 22:32:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>thomas</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[en]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[linguistics]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[politics]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.widmann.org.uk/?p=5080</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Scottish and British flags Originally uploaded by The Laird of Oldham The term Unionist historically meant a supporter of the Union between Great Britain and Ireland, and it was for instance in this sense that the Tories for many years called themselves the Unionist Party. The word has gradually changed its meaning, however, and it [...]]]></description>
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<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/jza84/5234586160/">Scottish and British flags</a><br />
Originally uploaded by <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/jza84/">The Laird of Oldham</a><br />
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<p>The term <i>Unionist</i> historically meant a supporter of the Union between Great Britain and Ireland, and it was for instance in this sense that the Tories for many years called themselves the Unionist Party.
<p>The word has gradually changed its meaning, however, and it now tends to mean a supporter of the Union between England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland, so the independence battle in Scotland is now between Nationalists and Unionists.
<p>For instance, the well-kent commentator Iain MacWhirter <a href="http://www.heraldscotland.com/comment/columnists/can-the-unionist-campaign-coalesce-round-one-leader.16827610">wrote this recently</a>: <i>&#8220;The danger now for the <b>Unionists</b> is that Mr Salmond – following the lead set by Mr Darling and Mr Cameron – may offer a version of independence that is so close to devolution max that Scots vote for it out of spite at not seeing their favoured option on the ballot paper.&#8221;</i>
<p>I&#8217;m not really aware of a better word &ndash; from a Scottish perspective, I guess one could talk about a <i>Britainist</i> or a <i>Great-Britainist</i>, but I think that might be a hindrance to understanding rather than a help.
<p>The shift in meaning is also not really a problem from a current perspective, but it does occasionally lead to confusion when modern readers are confronted with older texts containing the word ‘unionist’.
<p>I tried to do a plot using <a href="http://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=unionist%2Cunionism&#038;year_start=1800&#038;year_end=2000&#038;corpus=6&#038;smoothing=3">Google Ngram Viewer</a>, but I have a feeling the figures are probably dominated by Irish Unionism.  Does anybody have access to a Scottish corpus?</p>
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		<title>The problem with Siri</title>
		<link>http://blog.widmann.org.uk/2012/03/03/5215/</link>
		<comments>http://blog.widmann.org.uk/2012/03/03/5215/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Mar 2012 23:06:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>thomas</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[en]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[gadgets]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[IT]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[linguistics]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.widmann.org.uk/?p=5215</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Marcel bought himself an iPhone 4S last week, and it quickly became apparent that Siri wasn&#8217;t very good at understanding him, and a quick video search reveals it&#8217;s a common problem for people with Scottish accents, including me (watch this one, too, if you haven&#8217;t seen it yet). Apple claim Siri will get better at [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Marcel bought himself an iPhone 4S last week, and it quickly became apparent that <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siri_(software)">Siri</a> wasn&#8217;t very good at understanding him, and a quick video search reveals it&#8217;s a common problem for people with Scottish accents, including me (watch <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SGxKhUuZ0Rc">this one</a>, too, if you haven&#8217;t seen it yet).<br />
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/My40XgYEvLM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe></p>
<p>Apple claim Siri will get better at understanding its owner over time, but I&#8217;m somewhat doubtful whether it can be true.
<p>I&#8217;m sure it can relatively easily catalogue a speaker as west-coast American or Australian or whatever (if those accents have been programmed into it), and within those types it can then store typical values for each phoneme, but given that it never asks the user to type in a word or sentence it couldn&#8217;t comprehend, how can it possibly learn anything if an accent diverges too much from its expectations?
<p>I understand Apple want a product that people can just switch on and use, but for people with &#8220;strange&#8221; accents, surely it would be better to have the option of a dedicated training module rather than being stuck with a useless piece of software.</p>
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		<title>David Livingstone, the inventor of Newscots</title>
		<link>http://blog.widmann.org.uk/2012/02/23/4473/</link>
		<comments>http://blog.widmann.org.uk/2012/02/23/4473/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Feb 2012 21:11:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>thomas</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[althist]]></category>
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		<category><![CDATA[linguistics]]></category>
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		<description><![CDATA[(An article from the English-language Wikipedia of a parallel universe that slipped through a wormhole and ended up in my inbox.) David Livingstone was born on 19 March 1813 in the mill town of Blantyre, five years before Scotland would regain her independence as a result of the Napoleonic wars, into a Protestant family believed [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>(An article from the English-language Wikipedia of a parallel universe that slipped through a wormhole and ended up in my inbox.)</i>
<p><div class="wp-caption alignright" style="width: 160px"><img alt="" src="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/89/Livingstone_03.jpg/150px-Livingstone_03.jpg" title="Livingstone&#039;s statue" width="150" height="169" /><p class="wp-caption-text">Livingstone&#039;s statue in Princes Gate Gairdens, Edinburgh</p></div> David Livingstone was born on 19 March 1813 in the mill town of Blantyre, five years before Scotland would regain her independence as a result of the Napoleonic wars, into a Protestant family believed to be descended from the highland Livingstones, a clan that had been previously known as the Clan MacLea. Born to Neil Livingstone (1788–1856) and his wife Agnes (1782–1865), David, along with many of the Livingstones, was at the age of ten employed in the cotton mill of H. Monteith – David and brother John working 12-hour days as &#8220;piecers&#8221;, tying broken cotton threads on the spinning machines. The mill offered their workers schooling of which David took advantage.
<p>Gradually, and by dint of infinite patience and concentration, the young cotton worker became master of many languages, and began the scientific study of their structure.  About 1841 he had freed himself from all the burden of manual labour, and could occupy his thoughts with the dialect of his native district, West Central Scots; his first publication was a small collection of folk songs in the Ayrshire &amp; Lanrikshire dialect (1843). His remarkable abilities now attracted general attention, and he was helped to continue his studies undisturbed. His <i>Grammar of the Scots Dialects</i> (1848) was the result of much labour, and of journeys taken to every part of the country. Livingstone&#8217;s famous <i>Dictionary of the Scots Dialects</i> appeared in its original form in 1850, and from this publication dates all the wide cultivation of the popular language in Scots, since Livingstone really did no less than construct, out of the different materials at his disposal, a popular language or definite people&#8217;s language for Scotland. With certain modifications, the most important of which were introduced later by Livingstone himself, but also through a latter policy aiming to merge this Scots language with Buikscots, this language has become Newscots, one of Scotland&#8217;s three official languages (the others being Buikscots and Gaelic).
<p>He lived very quietly in lodgings in Glesga, surrounded by his books and shrinking from publicity, but his name grew into wide political favour as his ideas about the language of the workers and peasants became more and more the watch-word of the popular party.
<p>Livingstone holds perhaps an isolated place in literary history as the one man who has invented, or at least selected and constructed, a language which has pleased so many thousands of his countrymen that they have accepted it for their schools, their sermons and their songs. He died in Glesga on September 23, 1896, and was buried with public honours.</p>
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		<title>The impossibility of saying &#8220;neuf œufs&#8221; in French</title>
		<link>http://blog.widmann.org.uk/2012/01/30/4974/</link>
		<comments>http://blog.widmann.org.uk/2012/01/30/4974/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Jan 2012 23:53:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>thomas</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[en]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[fr]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[linguistics]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.widmann.org.uk/?p=4974</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Day 34: Nine eggs Originally uploaded by aaocarroll In an essay by Jurgen Klausenburger called &#8220;The morphologization and grammaticalization of French liason&#8221;, he quotes Pierre Swiggers (&#8220;How to Order Eggs in French&#8221; in Folia Linguistica 1985) for the following data: les œufs [le-zø] &#8220;the eggs&#8221; des œufs [de-zø] &#8220;(some) eggs&#8221; un œuf [ɛ̃-nœf] &#8220;an, one [...]]]></description>
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<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/aaocarroll/3480173258/">Day 34: Nine eggs</a><br />
Originally uploaded by <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/aaocarroll/">aaocarroll</a><br />
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<p>In an essay by Jurgen Klausenburger called &#8220;The morphologization and grammaticalization of French liason&#8221;, he quotes Pierre Swiggers (&#8220;How to Order Eggs in French&#8221; in <i>Folia Linguistica</i> 1985) for <a href="http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=KfwRGdEApcAC&#038;pg=PA183&#038;lpg=PA183&#038;dq=sept+oeufs&#038;source=bl&#038;ots=1ARudaaWKJ&#038;sig=dA167dvUM0bknyztJHjU17f8h9Q&#038;hl=en&#038;sa=X&#038;ei=ZrsRT7H6No_CswairaBL&#038;ved=0CDoQ6AEwAw#v=onepage&#038;q=sept%20oeufs&#038;f=false">the following data</a>:</p>
<table>
<tr>
<td>les œufs</td>
<td>[le-zø]</td>
<td>&#8220;the eggs&#8221;</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>des œufs</td>
<td>[de-zø]</td>
<td>&#8220;(some) eggs&#8221;</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>un œuf</td>
<td>[ɛ̃-nœf]</td>
<td>&#8220;an, one egg&#8221;</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>deux œufs</td>
<td>[dø-zø]</td>
<td>&#8220;two eggs&#8221;</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>trois œufs</td>
<td>[trwa-zø]</td>
<td>&#8220;three eggs&#8221;</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>quatre œufs</td>
<td>[katr-œf]</td>
<td>&#8220;four eggs&#8221;</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>cinq œufs</td>
<td>[sɛ̃k-œf]</td>
<td>&#8220;five eggs&#8221;</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>six œufs</td>
<td>[si-zø]</td>
<td>&#8220;six eggs&#8221;</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>sept œufs</td>
<td>[sɛt-œf]</td>
<td>&#8220;seven eggs&#8221;</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>huit œufs</td>
<td>[ɥit-œf]</td>
<td>&#8220;eight eggs&#8221;</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>*neuf œufs</td>
<td>[avoided!]</td>
<td>&#8220;nine eggs&#8221;</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>dix œufs</td>
<td>[di-zø]</td>
<td>&#8220;ten eggs&#8221;</td>
</tr>
</table>
<p>On the same topic, <a href="http://ckenb.blogspot.com/2008/11/neuf-ufs-nine-eggs.html">this blog posting</a> states the following:<br />
<blockquote>
<p>I had a professor when I was in college — a linguist from Normandy whose native language was French — who was very interested in and amused by such language quirks. He would come to France in the summer and go to outdoor markets to try to get people the say neuf œufs because he thought it was funny.
<p>Almost always, when he asked for nine eggs, the person replying would stick an adjective in between neuf and œufs — neuf beaux œufs, or neuf petits œufs, or neuf gros œufs. He said French people hesitated over the pronunciation of &#8220;nine eggs&#8221; otherwise.</p></blockquote>
<p>The blogger who wrote this seems to think the pronunciation of *<i>neuf œufs</i> ought to be [nœv-ø].  This seems also to be the opinion of my beloved wife, who thinks it&#8217;s avoided because this  would sound very similar to the French word for &#8220;nephew&#8221;, <i>neveu</i>.
<p>So I&#8217;m a little confused.  Is the missing pronunciation [nœv-ø] or [nœv-œf]? And why is it avoided?
<p>Also, are Klausenburger and Swigger right in claiming that <i>œufs</i> is pronounced as [œf] after a numeral ending in a consonant other than [-z]?  Do French native speakers even agree?</p>
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		<title>Engelsk eller dansk</title>
		<link>http://blog.widmann.org.uk/2012/01/09/4812/</link>
		<comments>http://blog.widmann.org.uk/2012/01/09/4812/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Jan 2012 17:44:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>thomas</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[da]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[education]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[en]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[linguistics]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[politics]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.widmann.org.uk/?p=4812</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[026/365 &#8211; Let it snow! Originally uploaded by kmardahl Handelshøjskolen i København (eller Copenhagen Business School, som de kalder sig nu) blev vist ret sure, da en af deres kandidater fik at vide, at hun ikke kunne blive dansk statsborger, da hun havde fuldført et engelsksproget studium: Af Justitsministeriets (Indfødsretskontorets) afslag af 16. november 2011 [...]]]></description>
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<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/kmardahl/4309776454/">026/365 &#8211; Let it snow!</a><br />
Originally uploaded by <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/kmardahl/">kmardahl</a><br />
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<p><a href="http://cbsobserver.dk/node/2159">Handelshøjskolen i København</a> (eller <i>Copenhagen Business School</i>, som de kalder sig nu) blev vist ret sure, da en af deres kandidater fik at vide, at hun ikke kunne blive dansk statsborger, da hun havde fuldført et engelsksproget studium:<br />
<blockquote>
<p>Af Justitsministeriets (Indfødsretskontorets) afslag af 16. november 2011 på Pavlina Ivanovas ansøgning om at opnå dansk statsborgerskab ved naturalisation fremgik det, at ”ministeriet ikke finder, at du kan omfattes af reglerne i § 11 i cirkulæreskrivelse nr. 61 af 22. september 2008 om retningslinjer for naturalisation, idet man ikke anser din cand.merc.-uddannelse i Finance and Strategic Management fra CBS for at opfylder betingelsen om at uddannelsen skal være ”af dansk karakter”, eftersom undervisningen og eksaminer på uddannelsen udelukkende er foregået på et andet sprog end dansk.”
<p>Den var ny. En cand.merc.-uddannelse fra CBS er udviklet og udbudt på et statsfinansieret dansk universitet, er akkrediteret af ACE Denmark, og er godkendt af Uddannelsesministeriet (der sågar har en Styrelse for International Uddannelse, der skal fremme internationaliseringen af de danske uddannelser på alle niveauer, under sig) og er reguleret af dansk lovgivning på lige fod med CBS’ øvrige uddannelser. Skulle den være udansk? Ikke i CBS’ optik.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>Men det er jo et interessant spørgsmål.  Man kan godt få det indtryk, at danskere synes, at engelsk i Danmark er skønt, så længe det er engelsk talt af danskere, ikke hvis engelsk bruges af udlændinge, der bor i Danmark.
<p>Men sagen er jo den, at den nuværende situation ikke kan forventes at være permanent.  Hvis danske uddannelser og arbejdspladser i stigende grad er engelsksprogede, så vil der efterhånden opstå en større og større gruppe af mennesker, der bor i Danmark, men kun taler nødtørftigt dansk, da de bruger engelsk 95% af tiden.
<p>Alt, der mangler, er, at det bliver tilladt at kommunikere med de offentlige myndigheder på engelsk, og så vil gruppen af engelsktalende nydanskere formentlig vokse år for år.  Men tiden vil der sikkert også være forældre, som ikke engang kan se pointen i at lære deres børn ordentligt dansk.
<p>Hvis det ikke er det, man vil, så bør man nok snart begynde at værne noget mere om det danske sprogs position ved ikke konstant at øge mængden af sammenhænge, hvor man kan (eller skal) bruge engelsk i stedet for dansk.</p>
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		<title>A symbol for &#8220;is pronounced the same as&#8221;</title>
		<link>http://blog.widmann.org.uk/2012/01/08/4914/</link>
		<comments>http://blog.widmann.org.uk/2012/01/08/4914/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Jan 2012 00:13:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>thomas</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[en]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[linguistics]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[typography]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.widmann.org.uk/?p=4914</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Yesterday&#8217;s blog posting made me think about the lack of a symbol for &#8220;is pronounced the same as&#8221;. What I mean is that instead of writing that &#8220;write is pronounced the same as right&#8220;, we could just write &#8220;write ≗ right&#8220;. I here used the symbol &#8220;≗&#8221;, not because I think it&#8217;s ideal, but because [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yesterday&#8217;s <a href="http://blog.widmann.org.uk/2012/01/07/4794/">blog posting</a> made me think about the lack of a symbol for &#8220;is pronounced the same as&#8221;.
<p>What I mean is that instead of writing that &#8220;<i>write</i> is pronounced the same as <i>right</i>&#8220;, we could just write &#8220;<i>write</i> ≗ <i>right</i>&#8220;.
<p>I here used the symbol &#8220;≗&#8221;, not because I think it&#8217;s ideal, but because it&#8217;s available.  Other available Unicode characters based on the equal sign include the following: ≘ ≙ ≚ ≛ ≜ ≝ ≞
<p>However, ideally I think I&#8217;d want square brackets on top of an equal sign because pronunciations are given in square brackets, like this:<a href="http://blog.widmann.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/pronsameas.png"><img src="http://blog.widmann.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/pronsameas.png" alt="" title="pronounced the same as" width="88" height="111" class="aligncenter size-full wp-image-4919" /></a>
<p>Does anybody know of any existing symbol that has been used for this?</p>
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